NYC Fire Hydrant Hiding in an Unconventional Location

NYC fire hydrant ambush that will catch you every time

This NYC fire hydrant is a parking ticket waiting to happen. Where is it safe to park? How do you measure 15 feet?

There was a fascinating conversation on Reddit about 11 months ago.  A member asked the following question:

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Illegal hydrant? Got ticket, doesn’t seem right…

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On Google Street view you will see a hydrant off the curb and encircled (hidden) by a custom brick wall. The curb is not marked and I can’t see how firemen will not have problems attaching a hose. Depending on how you pull in to park, you can easily not see this. My parents got a ticket and I want to help fight it.

Here’s the culprit

[–]5 points 11 months ago

This is a very strange arrangement, and apparently similar to two other hydrants on the block. I’m a native New Yorker and I have never seen a hydrant on what appears to be private property.

I’m really surprised at all the negativity here. It is essentially impossible for anyone to get a lawyer to fight for something like this as the full fine is less than even a beginning lawyer’s bill would be.

I suggest taking a look at https://newyorkparkingticket.com/ especially the Blog section and see what they have on the subject of hydrants.

[–]1 point 11 months ago

There are several websites advertising they will “fight any parking ticket” for 50% of the savings. No idea if they use lawyers or trained aardvarks or robots to do it, but it’s certainly cheaper than paying someone hourly.

I have to assume the city has an easement if those are operational hydrants though.

[Larry’s comment: Correct about the easement. Incorrect about the hydrant having to be operational]

[–]2 points 11 months ago

I have to assume the city has an easement if those are operational hydrants though.

I would never assume anything on the part of the city.

[–]5 points 11 months ago*

You should at least reference the section of law referenced on the ticket.

IANAL but you can attempt to make the argument that the fire hydrant is behind a property line and is on private property and therefore not subject to NYC DOT traffic rules and the impetus is for the complainant to submit proof that the hydrant is subject to an easement/right-of-way agreement between NYC DEP and the property owner.

[Larry’s comment: It is always, never changes, the defendant’s burden to prove she parked more than 15 feet from a hydrant. And, it is the defendant’s burden to prove an affirmative defense (the private property defense). Sadly, the private property defense is a losing defense].

More comments

[–]10 points 11 months ago

Your parents parked in front of a hydrant. What makes you think it is illegal? Even if it was (it’s not) what makes you think their ability to attach a hose somehow negates you parents wrongdoing. Pay the ticket and move on with your life.

[–]0 points 11 months ago

Nearly $150 ticket for something they did not see until returning to the car and getting a ticket. The things that make me think it’s illegal are listed in my post- the fact that the sidewalk is not marked while the hydrant is set in, and that it is enclosed by a private brick wall that concealed the hydrant from a street parker.

[Larry’s comment: The invisible fire hydrant defense rarely, if ever works. So, the fact that you may have to walk a few steps to see it, will not set you free. Check out the image below of a pile of garbage. It’s hiding a fire hydrant. We won this, but it took an appeal].

[–]8 points 11 months ago

the fact that the sidewalk is not marked while the hydrant is set in

Per NYC DOT website:

It is illegal to park within 15 feet of either side of a fire hydrant. The painted curbs at hydrant locations do not indicate where you can park.

[Larry’s comment: Correct!].

[–]2 points 11 months ago

Look at this whole block, none of the hydrants are marked and they are all “encircled” by brick. Nothing illegal about it, just how the block is. It sucks that this guys parents didn’t see the hydrant, but there’s nothing to fight.

[Larry’s comment: Partially correct. Did they park more than 15 feet from the hydrant? Were there any omitted, misdescribed, required elements?]

[–]4 points 11 months ago

Nothing illegal about it, just how the block is. … there’s nothing to fight.

That’s my point.

Still more comments

[–]3 points 11 months ago

Got it, I misread your post.

[–]6 points 11 months ago

Are you not from New York? Hydrant in NYC is not normally marked. The fact that your parents did not see the hydrant is not an excuse, no judge is going to accept that. It’s not visibly blocked by anything and clearly accessible to the fire dept.

[–]5 points 11 months ago

Here is a photo of hydrant http://imgur.com/dDsOz3p

[–]2 points 11 months ago

Haha, holy crap. I would try to fight it just because it is ridiculous. Maybe the judge will cut you a break. But I’m not sure there is a legal defense. But submit that picture definitely in your objection to the ticket.

Also, consider telling this story to the NY Post or Gothamist or something. Could see someone being interested.

[–]1 point 11 months ago

Try contacting the fire department with the address of the hydrant. See if it is actually in use. You could use that as evidence at your court hearing.

[Larry’s comment: The fact that a fire hydrant may not be operational is not a defense].

[–]2 points 11 months ago

311, not Queens Fire dispatch would not connect me to Ladder Co. #136 in Queens & I can’t find a # via Google. Anyone know how to call a specific fire department?

[–]1 point 11 months ago

There is some precedent for the city using similar scenarios to make a killing on tickets. You can probably win if you fight this. See this: http://iquantny.tumblr.com/post/144197004989/the-nypd-was-systematically-ticketing-legally

[–]-2 points 11 months ago*

I think you have a good chance of the ticket being thrown out just by presenting these photos to a judge. The wall obscures the hydrant from the street, and the hydrant is a similar color to the darker bricks in the wall. For all intents and purposes, its camouflaged. That said, there’s no guarantee.

Rogues gallery of fire hydrants

Commentary

In my humble opinion, when you stumble upon a fire hydrant in a peculiar location, don’t be tricked. You are still required to park 15 feet away. If any part of your chariot is less than 15 feet from a hydrant, please move along little doggie.

For example, if you extend a tape measure on a diagonal from the hydrant to the curb and it measures 12 feet, it is not a legal parking space. $115 is too much to spend on parking. (and risk a tow, yikes!).

The Evil Empire has an easement to use the homeowner’s property to install a fire hydrant. So, don’t think that the fact a hydrant is living on private property, you get out of jail free pass. You don’t (same easement theory for a “public sidewalk”).

What do you think about these fire hydrant fundraisers?

Since we’re on the subject of ambushes and possible blunders, here are five more fire hydrant mistakes to avoid.